Beginner styling advice
- Jakob
- Offline Topic Author
- New Member
- Posts: 8
- Thanks received: 0
I've been growing this tree I got from the wild for about two years now. I've mostly been letting it grow to try and thicken its trunk amateurishly trying some wiring in the meantime. The trunk is about 2cm thick right now so I think it's time I start planning its shape a bit more. Since this is my first tree that got to this point I'm a bit lost so I would appreciate any advice when it comes to styling it.
Thanks for all your suggestions.
Thanks for all your suggestions.
by Jakob
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- Tropfrog
- Offline
- Platinum Member
- Posts: 4557
- Thanks received: 1494
I would proboably get rid of two out of three trunks in the long run. Proboably , I would remove the thickest one first and use the other one as sacrificial branch a few years. The one I would keep in the long run is the one with most movement. But now is not the right time for big cuts. Early spring just before budbreak is the right window. So wait another year for first big cut and until the sacrificial branch has helped with taper to remove that one.
Last Edit:8 months 2 days ago
by Tropfrog
Last edit: 8 months 2 days ago by Tropfrog.
The following user(s) said Thank You: Jakob
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- Jakob
- Offline Topic Author
- New Member
- Posts: 8
- Thanks received: 0
Hmm I kinda liked the idea of trying to go for a design with three branches but your suggestion seems interesting as well. What's?the size of the tree/thickness of the trunk you'd aim for?
by Jakob
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- Tropfrog
- Offline
- Platinum Member
- Posts: 4557
- Thanks received: 1494
There are no fixed rules, but there are guidelines. The guideline is a ratio of 1/6 to 1/12 trunk with to tree hight. Where the lower value would be percieved as a better tree. I do not know the species, but it seems to be a very big leaf one. It all depends on how much it is possible to reduce leaf size. If it does not reduce at all, we are looking at a tree at the maximum size for a bonsai, around a meter tall. That would take a trunk diameter of approx 10 to 20 cm. If they reduce good maybe 50-60 cm and trunk 5-10cm. In any case this tree have several years left to grow and there are no hurry to take a final decition.
To me it seams like the two outer trunks is very close to another. In some species that easily creates inverse taper in that spot. A feature concidered a flaw, but somewhat accepted in the broom style. I do not think this tree is a good material for broom style.
But as always, I have not seen the tree live, it is your tree, you are the artist and you make the decitions.
To me it seams like the two outer trunks is very close to another. In some species that easily creates inverse taper in that spot. A feature concidered a flaw, but somewhat accepted in the broom style. I do not think this tree is a good material for broom style.
But as always, I have not seen the tree live, it is your tree, you are the artist and you make the decitions.
by Tropfrog
The following user(s) said Thank You: Jakob
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- Jakob
- Offline Topic Author
- New Member
- Posts: 8
- Thanks received: 0
I see. Thank you very much for the advice. I suspect it may be some variety of beech as they are pretty common in the forests around here.
Should I try defoliation to try and reduce its leaf size? When is the right time to defoliate?
Should I try defoliation to try and reduce its leaf size? When is the right time to defoliate?
by Jakob
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- Tropfrog
- Offline
- Platinum Member
- Posts: 4557
- Thanks received: 1494
Defoliation is a technique used in show preparation of mature trees in late refinement stage. It is very stressful for the tree and slow down growth.
This tree will not be ready for a show in decades. Growth and vigour is what you need, then defoliation should not be concidered an option.
You may ask how you would know how much leaf reduces on the species if you cannot use the full toolbox for leaf reduction? That is one of the reason to visit a nearby club. They can tell you what is possible with the species in your area and you can make your long term plan based on that information.
This tree will not be ready for a show in decades. Growth and vigour is what you need, then defoliation should not be concidered an option.
You may ask how you would know how much leaf reduces on the species if you cannot use the full toolbox for leaf reduction? That is one of the reason to visit a nearby club. They can tell you what is possible with the species in your area and you can make your long term plan based on that information.
by Tropfrog
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- m5eaygeoff
- Offline
- Platinum Member
- Posts: 3202
- Thanks received: 921
It looks like a Hazel nut or similar, and very young. I would go with asingle trunk also.
by m5eaygeoff
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- FrankC
- Offline
- Elite Member
- Posts: 276
- Thanks received: 164
I would wait until winter time.
In winter time you can see the branch and stem structure , wich gives a more clear view before to start cutting. (you can always cut, but never put branches back)
In this stage don't defoliate the tree, you can remove some of the largest leaves to give light on the inside of the canopy.
In winter time you can see the branch and stem structure , wich gives a more clear view before to start cutting. (you can always cut, but never put branches back)
In this stage don't defoliate the tree, you can remove some of the largest leaves to give light on the inside of the canopy.
by FrankC
The following user(s) said Thank You: Albas
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- beredis
- Offline
- New Member
- Posts: 3
- Thanks received: 1
Regarding leaf size, it’s true that some species have more potential for leaf reduction than others. Large leaves can be a challenge in achieving the desired miniature effect. If the leaves of your tree species do not reduce significantly, aiming for a larger bonsai, as you mentioned, around 1 meter tall with a trunk diameter of 10 to 20 cm, would be appropriate. Conversely, if the leaves can be reduced effectively, a smaller bonsai with a height of 50-60 cm and a trunk diameter of 5-10 cm could work well. The concern about the two outer trunks being very close is valid, as this can lead to inverse tapering, which is generally undesirable in bonsai. However, as you noted, some styles like the broom style can be more forgiving of this feature. It’s important to monitor the growth and adjust your training techniques accordingly to prevent or minimize such flaws.
by beredis
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- m5eaygeoff
- Offline
- Platinum Member
- Posts: 3202
- Thanks received: 921
When a tree is in development the leaf size is not relevant, in fact it is better if they are normal size. Only when the tree is in refinement is it necessary to reduce leaf size. Leaf size has a direct relationship to photosynthesis and growth which is what is needed when a tree is being developed. The only trees I will partially defoliate for example is ones that are in refinement, and I never fully defoliate any tree.
by m5eaygeoff
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.