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Hi!
I'm looking for artificial lighting to help my six trees througout the winter. I live in the far north of sweden, the winter is long and I won't be able to rely on natural sunlight for quite a big part of it. I'm currently not able to keep a room unheated so they will be kept in room temperature, although "room temperature" might drop to 18c or such.
I've researched a bit and I'm now deciding between:
* Getting a few 20W LED's (specialized for overwintering with lots of blue light) and mount them on moving arms. Benefits being ease of handling and directing the light so it doesn't just hit the trees from straight above. As well as placing the light source closer to the trees due to the lower heat output.
* Getting a LightWave T5 armature (unsure which model is sufficient for overwintering. Ranging from 3300 lumen to 33 200 lumen output) Benefits being a much highter light output per price.

The trees are Ficus Retusa, Portulacaria Afra, Ulmus Parvifolia, Ligustrum Sinense, Podocarpus Macrophyllus and Sageretia Theezans.

Thanks for any directions

Most people frequenting this forum grow bonsai where they belong: outdoors.
There are very few people that use grow lights. You may not get answers to your questions.

I do use indoor grow Lights for different projects. But not for bonsai.

When shopping for grow Lights, dont Believe all the sales pitches and The technical statements of the products. All of Them is so much better than the competition. The sheapest is to find used armatures and buy good bulbs for Them. If you are willing to invest more, then go for led. Anyway, aming for high lumen output around 4000-8000 kelvin and high cri will get you a good combination of estetics and value for money.

Br
Magnus

Auk wrote: Most people frequenting this forum grow bonsai where they belong: outdoors.
There are very few people that use grow lights. You may not get answers to your questions.

When I'm in a living situation where I'm able to keep trees outdoors all year around I certainly will. But until then I'm quite happy to keep experimenting and learning any way I can, and I hope that one day I will be happy that I decided to invest in this art form and hobby even though my conditions weren't optimal. I appreciate your straight forwardness and understand that it can be frustrating if beginners come up with questions that are irrelevant to the consensus of the forum. I will direct further questions specifically about keeping trees indoor elsewhere.

Tropfrog wrote: When shopping for grow Lights, dont Believe all the sales pitches and The technical statements of the products. All of Them is so much better than the competition. The sheapest is to find used armatures and buy good bulbs for Them. If you are willing to invest more, then go for led. Anyway, aming for high lumen output around 4000-8000 kelvin and high cri will get you a good combination of estetics and value for money.

Helpful advice. Thanks!

Bragaluf wrote: I appreciate your straight forwardness and understand that it can be frustrating if beginners come up with questions that are irrelevant to the consensus of the forum.

No, that's not it, really. it's frustrating FOR beginners as it's really much harder to keep trees indoors. Your trees can survive indoors, but they will not thrive. For bonsai, you need trees that are in the best possible condition, and indoors that's hard to accomplish.

That's why few people grow bonsai indoors - with exceptions - and that's simply why you will probably not get the answers you are looking for.

Auk wrote:

Bragaluf wrote: I appreciate your straight forwardness and understand that it can be frustrating if beginners come up with questions that are irrelevant to the consensus of the forum.

No, that's not it, really. it's frustrating FOR beginners as it's really much harder to keep trees indoors. Your trees can survive indoors, but they will not thrive. For bonsai, you need trees that are in the best possible condition, and indoors that's hard to accomplish.

That's why few people grow bonsai indoors - with exceptions - and that's simply why you will probably not get the answers you are looking for.

But on the other side.....None of the mentioned species will survive Norrland winters outside.

Some of Them might survive in a frost free shed without Light during the winter, but for sure not all of Them.

Bragaluf: your list of species is quite similar to what a big german Chain sold a few weeks ago in Sweden. Is that your source? Dont post any pictures, People here will tell you it is not bonsai. Anyway: althou it was quite ugly pots, the trees was healthy and in a quite good soil for mallsais. I would say it is quite good material for the price and that some of Them had potential to be really nice bonsais given time.

But dont expect all of Them to survive the winter.

Br
Magnus

Tropfrog wrote: But on the other side.....None of the mentioned species will survive Norrland winters outside.

Let's have a look at a random place in the far north of Sweden:


I see lots of trees there, several species, just living outdoors. Quite a few of them should be suitable for bonsai.

Looking at the species list, I think the sageretia Theezans will give you the biggest trouble. The rest will do well in a windowsill, assuming they are not right over a heater.

I avoid tropicals where possible, and only have a dozen or so trees that I need to bring in. None of them get additional light. Sweden however is half of the light I get in winter. So there I would look into supplemental light. My main concern would be energy usage per lumen, and not purchase price per lumen. Not sure what you are comparing. Make sure they are for plants and not just any type of LED, which I think you have done. '
As said, I do not use grow lights. I can imagine that you would need them as you are a few hundred KM north of me.

Don't worry about tropfrog and his bee-in-bonnet. Please show what you are putting together. It is all a bit theorethical right now.

Auk wrote:

Tropfrog wrote: But on the other side.....None of the mentioned species will survive Norrland winters outside.

Let's have a look at a random place in the far north of Sweden:


I see lots of trees there, several species, just living outdoors. Quite a few of them should be suitable for bonsai.

Ahh, your so kind telling me that there are trees outside my Window. I couldt guess myself, Thanks a lot. Maybe i didnt recognice Them because all trees I see on tv is burning. Here they are not.

With all that wisdom and experience, please tell me: which one of the trees in the initial post will survive outdoors in Norrland winters? I have heard that different species have different needs.

Br
Magnus

Tropfrog wrote: Ahh, your so kind telling me that there are trees outside my Window.

Not at all. I have no idea where your window is, nor do I know what grows up north in Sweden, so I took a look.